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Permit ($10?) required for Blue Hole area - All activities

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  • Permit ($10?) required for Blue Hole area - All activities

    Read it and weep. (Or maybe not, it will reduce overcrowding). I think I'll use Denning for Table and Peekamoose from now on, especially if it involves $$.


    There is a discrepancy in the article, twice it mentions $10.00 for a permit, and once it says free.
    Tom Rankin - 5444W, etc., etc.

    Web Master - NY Forest Fire Lookout Association
    Member #0003 - ADKHP Foundation
    Volunteer - Balsam Lake Mountain
    Past President - Catskill 3500 Club
    CEO - Views And Brews

  • #2
    It is a shame that it has come to this. Should have posted and closed the creek for a year or two.. Even with permits for day use the area is ruined. Anyone found in the creek prosecuted for trespassing. Gone are the days of going for a hike and cooling off your feet in the water for a few minutes and be the only one there.

    Comment


    • #3
      Apparently, it IS $10, someone has paid for it and posted on f.b.
      Tom Rankin - 5444W, etc., etc.

      Web Master - NY Forest Fire Lookout Association
      Member #0003 - ADKHP Foundation
      Volunteer - Balsam Lake Mountain
      Past President - Catskill 3500 Club
      CEO - Views And Brews

      Comment


      • #4
        I'm very, very sorry to hear this. It is a real shame that it has come to this. I have many fond memories of Blue Hole and those times are certainly behind us.
        To Go and to See
        Is to Know and to Be

        Comment


        • #5
          C'mon, it's only $10. How much do you spend on gas to get to the trailhead? I'm personally very happy to see this, and don't mind paying $10 a few times a year to climb Peekamoose & Table, or when spotting a car for The Six. No more gangbangers with their loud boomboxes, beer bottles all over the ground, BBQs all over, diapers, trash, etc. This may not be a popular opinion on this site, but MANY folks on FB have a similar outlook as I about this.

          Comment


          • #6
            I believe Reserve America charges $10 "processing" or "handling" or something per reservation.

            This recent article in the Washington Post points out that reservations and permits are being implemented across the country, at Yosemite, Acadia, Glacier National Park, the ADKs, etc. https://www.washingtonpost.com/lifes...489_story.html

            For example: "79 trailheads within two Oregon forests will require permits, making up about 25 percent of the overall trails."

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by Blowdown Gang View Post
              C'mon, it's only $10. How much do you spend on gas to get to the trailhead? I'm personally very happy to see this, and don't mind paying $10 a few times a year to climb Peekamoose & Table, or when spotting a car for The Six. No more gangbangers with their loud boomboxes, beer bottles all over the ground, BBQs all over, diapers, trash, etc. This may not be a popular opinion on this site, but MANY folks on FB have a similar outlook as I about this.
              I understand your perspective but let me share mine. Growing up, I would bike to Blue Hole several times per week in the summer. It was a place where I'd frequently run into other people I knew, or sometimes I'd have it to myself. I'd take a dip, eat a snack, and bike back home. Now that I'm older and still live fairly locally, I'd head up that direction with regularity. Peekamoose and Table (from the Blue Hole lot) are my "local" mountains. When I have a day to hike and don't have a specific objective in mind, a quick hike up Peekamoose and Table was a go-to of mine. Then, as I got more serious about peak bagging, I'd always begin the 9 from the Blue Hole lot. I'd do the 9 when conditions were right, when I was feeling like it, or perhaps when a friend wanted to join. It was certainly never something I planned out far in advance.

              The stream up that direction, not just at Blue Hole, has been a frequent visit for me in the summer months. I'm no longer able to do that, due to these regulations. As much as I generally despise "locals only" ethics, I do think locals such as myself should be excluded from these permits and regulations. The state has effectively put a local resource, just a short drive from my home, off-limits to me. By implementing these permits the state is effectively making the Peekamoose Valley only for out of town folks, as I just can't see any locals actually planning out a "trip" fifteen or twenty minutes from home.

              I took a drive up that way on my way home from work today. The entire corridor is now labeled as a tow-away zone. Sides of the road have been staked off, to prevent parking. No overnight parking is possible, even with a permit. To me, as a local, this feels like a police state. I do not like it and do not support this permit system and increased regulations. I do agree that Blue Hole needs something done but to remove the entire Peekamoose Valley seems like a tremendous overreach.
              To Go and to See
              Is to Know and to Be

              Comment


              • Blowdown Gang
                Blowdown Gang commented
                Editing a comment
                Thank you for sharing all that. I understand completely as a similar situation had occurred some years ago to my "local" mountains. As a more recent transplant to the Catskills (West Hurley), I've been dismayed to see the destruction of the Blue Hole area especially over the past 5 or 6 years or so. And that is why my initial reaction to the new fees was so positive. I agree that locals should be excluded, even if I was not considered local.

                Thanks again for your thoughtful post and the your perspective of the situation.

            • #8
              Originally posted by Daniel Eagan View Post
              I believe Reserve America charges $10 "processing" or "handling" or something per reservation.

              This recent article in the Washington Post points out that reservations and permits are being implemented across the country, at Yosemite, Acadia, Glacier National Park, the ADKs, etc. https://www.washingtonpost.com/lifes...489_story.html

              For example: "79 trailheads within two Oregon forests will require permits, making up about 25 percent of the overall trails."
              So previous reservations (2019 and before) were $10? Would be interested in some comments. Otherwise sounds like a windfall for Reserve America.

              Comment


              • #9
                Originally posted by Hear the Footsteps View Post

                So previous reservations (2019 and before) were $10? Would be interested in some comments. Otherwise sounds like a windfall for Reserve America.
                No, it was free for the user in the past. Of course, someone was paying for it, NYS Taxpayers... Never mind police, rangers, the cost of putting up the barriers and signs, etc.

                My first post has a link to the places where a fee is charged.
                Tom Rankin - 5444W, etc., etc.

                Web Master - NY Forest Fire Lookout Association
                Member #0003 - ADKHP Foundation
                Volunteer - Balsam Lake Mountain
                Past President - Catskill 3500 Club
                CEO - Views And Brews

                Comment


                • #10
                  I think it is a very sad situation for the true locals, who were used to making spur of the moment plans to either cool off or to hike something local. for the rest of us, it is a very minor inconvenience. There are other places to access P&T, and it is only for 4 months. W&C cost $10 in the summer too, and so do Plateau and SWH. Obviously, one could avoid paying the $10 and hike the said peaks from elsewhere. But unless I plan to hike Peek every day, shelling out $10 once in a blue moon does not bother me. I spent more in gas just getting there.

                  it is much more difficult to hike the 6 from other trailheads, so one would have to think ahead. I personally tend to plan this hike well in advance as it involves more than just 1 car, and pretty much every such outing has been planned out at least a few weeks ahead. Guess that's just me. I just made a reservation for a date next week and I was the first one to do so.

                  as far as why they had to go to such extreams... Besides the obvious, I think there are a few other reasons. I have been to the spot on the weekends and it was pristine while the trailhead was staffed. and I also have hiked from there on a Friday, when it was a complete disaster - with no stewards around all week, it did not take long for the slobs to trash the place. So, 7 days a week control makes sense. As far as making hikers part of this - yeah, it sucks but the hikers would arrive early and take up valuable parking spots. so I can see how the Blue Hole visitors would be shut out if they were to arrive later, while the permit system would take into the account all the spaces that should be available. Now all the visitors are accounted for.
                  46/46 as of August 1st, 2014!

                  Comment


                  • tcd
                    tcd commented
                    Editing a comment
                    This is an important point:

                    "I have been to the spot on the weekends and it was pristine while the trailhead was staffed. and I also have hiked from there on a Friday, when it was a complete disaster - with no stewards around all week, it did not take long for the slobs to trash the place."

                    Same here in the Adirondacks. Observations have shown that the #1 most effective way to "protect the resource" is to have Front Country Stewards present at all times, educating the visitors in person. Yet the state steadfastly refuses to pay for such a program. (Yes, this year the state is funding 3 part time Front Country Stewards in the High Peaks. This is a microscopic drop in the bucket of what is needed for a professionally designed and managed user education program.)

                  • YanaLG
                    YanaLG commented
                    Editing a comment
                    Agree completely - summit stewards in the Catskills had observed similar pattern, especially near the camping areas on Giant Ledge. I believe that the DEC is also funding the summit steward program in the Catskills that the Trail Conference has been running for the last 10 years or so (3500 Club has provided the initial seed money). I am hoping the new adopt a trailhead initiative will make a difference too. Yet, I feel in some places, you need constant patrolling.

                  • tcd
                    tcd commented
                    Editing a comment
                    Summit Steward programs are nice. But by the time people get to the summit, it's way too late, and most of the damage is done. It may be an unpopular opinion, but I would submit that damage to species on summits that are common elsewhere (thousands of acres in places like Newfoundland) is less important than litter, poop and toilet paper all over the woods on the way to the summits. To my knowledge, DEC does not even fund the summit steward program in the Adirondacks. The DEC talk about the summit steward program is a bunch of circular bull**** designed to hide the fact that they don't actually support it in any way.

                    Yes, you need constant patrolling - absolutely right. And volunteer adopter groups simply cannot do this. The state is the ONLY level that has the money to support a real program, but they refuse to do so.

                    So expect more closures, as the state locks the people out of places that the people supposedly "own" because the state refuses to properly manage these places.
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