looking for route ideas for a 3 day weekend

[bapazian1]

Hi everyone. I'm an experienced backpacker but new to the Catskills. I am looking to do a long weekend trip (2 nights, 3 days) in the Catskills. Normally I wouldn't ask for suggestions and just try out something that looks interesting on the topo map but on this outing I have special considerations.

I am bringing my girlfriend along and this will be her first time backpacking. It is also the first time for her with "backcountry camping". She is in pretty good shape, enjoys hiking, but I want it to be very enjoyable and on the easier side. If I was alone I would probably take on the Devil's Path but I don't think that would be the best first place for her.

A few questions and thoughts that may help narrow down routes.

- I would prefer to do a loop as we would like to take just 1 car.
- If any campsites in the catskills have any sort of latrine/throne/etc. that would be preferable to places where catholes would be required.
- We're looking for a medium mileage hike 6-12 mile days depending on terrain. If the campsites are real nice and have nice thigns to explore nearby I'd enjoy the shorter days more as it makes hanging around camp that much more fun.
- Routes that include nice stands of Balsam/spruce/other conifer cover would be excellent.

Other than that a few questions:

Are water sources often hard to find?
Hanging bear bags is effective in this area?
In case backpacking doesn't seem viable is it legal to camp at state campgrounds (say Woodland) even though they don't officially open until may 18?

Thanks for any info you can provide!

[mountainmeijin]

Perhaps a loop around Big Hollow. You start at Barnum Road, hike over the Blackhead Range, camp at Batavia Kill, then make your second day up over Acra Point, Burnt Knob and Windham, camp the second night at Elm Ridge, then out in the morning to road walk back. Lots and lots of spruce and balsam along the Blackhead Range.

Nice territory, you gain 4 high peaks and not too long or challenging. 14 miles or so for the loop, roughly, and maybe 3700' vertical gain, but there are a few miles of road walk at the end to close the loop. There's a spring on the Black Dome trail, a little of the Lockwood Gap. Another one near Elm Ridge. Not sure how they'll be flowing after all this dry weather.

Bear bags might be okay if hung well, but bear canisters are preferable. I don't believe camping is allowed at the campgrounds when they're closed.

[mountainmeijin]

Also, maybe a loop involving Rusk (if you're into bushwhacking) Hunter, SWH and Westkill. Two good lean-tos in the area and lots of springs for water.

[DSettahr]

Water sources aren't hard to find, if you do your research. Some maps (like the NYNJTC and the Venture Out maps) show springs, which tend to flow pretty reliably year-round. Other maps, like the new National Geographic Map, don't show springs, and it can be a lot harder to find water. Many of the smaller streams and creeks in the Catskills will go dry in the summer.

Loop hikes tend to be in short supply in the Catskills. The aforementioned loop over the Blackhead Range and Windham High Peak isn't a bad one. Another possible loop would be the Slide Mountain Wilderness- you could start at the Slide Mountain trailhead on Route 47 on day one, climb Slide Mountain, and camp at one of the designated campsites (there are 5 or 6 of them) in the col between Slide and Cornell Mountains. On day 2, climb Cornell and Wittenburg, descend to Woodland Valley, and climb Giant's Ledge, and camp at the designated campsite on the summit of Giant's Ledge. Day three, descend back to Route 47, and walk a couple of miles down the road back to your car. One potential drawback to this route- it's pretty rugged, and it might not be the best route for someone who has never been backpacking before.

Another option- for a first time backpacking trip, it might not be a bad idea to "basecamp" instead of doing a loop where you relocate the second night. Echo Lake would be a great spot to take someone who has never been backpacking before, and an even better spot to take a girlfriend. It's a beautiful lake (one of the only backcountry lakes in the Catskills), and there is a lean-to as well as 5 or 6 designated campsites scattered around the perimeter of the lake, so finding a spot to camp shouldn't be a problem. Best way to reach it is by climbing up and over Overlook Mountain, but anyone in reasonable shape should have little difficulty making the climb (it follows an old road). The views from Overlook are spectacular, and if you want, you could also climb Indian Head on the second day for more great views.

Hope that helps.

[bapazian1]

Thanks for all the replies and route suggestions! I think that all the routes listed could work and I will probably plan out several options and adjust accordingly based on weather, how we're feeling, and other such factors.

A few more questions that came to mind.

What does a "primitive campsite" entail? My guess would be tent pad, "throne" pit toilet, fire ring.

What does a shelter typically have at the campsite?

Do campsites usually have some sort of primitive camp furniture ie strategically placed logs or stones to sit on?

Are primitive campsites/lean to's(shelters) usually a shared thing or is it 1 group per site?

Is there any permit/fee for camping on DEC land?

If basecamping is what we decided on, is it safe to leave tents pitched at camps for day trips?

The water sources listed on the NYNJ maps are natural springs which need to be treated for giardia right?

Any thoughts on the bug situation this time of year? I'd expect to see ticks but probably not mosquitos or flies quite yet.

Any good places to check weather for the higher elevations. I'm guessing the towns in the valleys vary quite a bit from the higher elevation forecast.

and a few more specific questions about routes:

On the Wittenburgh, Cornell, Slide loop, is there any major pros or cons to doing the loop clockwise or counterclockwise? Also is the section on the on the Phoenicia East Branch Trail just NE of the parking area on 47 parallel to the road or is on the road.

Looking at the NYNJ map set I only see one primitive campsite in the Col between Slide and Cornell. Is there really 5?

On the blackhead range route: How long is the roadwalk section and is there an ideal route to head through the roads. Looking at the map it seems like there are several options on what roads to choose so any input would be appreciated.

Thanks in advance for any and all responses. I'm really excited to try out some hikes in the Catskills!

[mountainmeijin]

Well, let's see what I can answer.

1. A primitive campsite is just that. Usually just a clearing in the woods where pitching a tent is allowed. Some of the lean-tos have pit latrines, but not the campsites, as far as I've seen.

2. The shelter is whatever you bring along.

3. Again, primitive campsite is very bare-bones, so no furniture. Some stones or logs may be scattered around, but nothing fancy.

4. Lean-tos are first come, first serve. So they may get a little crowded sometimes, but here in the Cats, space usually isn't too much of an issue.

5. There is a camping fee at state campgrounds, but not at primitive sites on state land in the woods.

6. You may want to take valuables with you, or cache them. Leaving a note might also be a good idea in case a ranger comes along and is curious as to where the owner is. I've never had a problem leaving a tent up, though, so long as it was within the rules.

7. Bring some bug spray. They're coming out.

8. Usually for the upper elevations, you want to expect about 10-15 degrees cooler and a slightly higher chance of precipitation because of the orographic lifting effect. Being prepared is the best defense.

9. Clockwise is probably the better direction, as it has you going up the steepest parts rather than down, which could be difficult with full packs. Also, Slide makes a nice climax for the hike. Also, the last leg of the hike back to Woodland Valley will be mostly downhill from there, save for one bump near the end. The Slide trailhead is 1100' higher than the Woodland Valley trailhead. The trail overlaps with the road at that point. You can save yourself a little work by taking the abandoned trail across the property easement at the north end of Winnisook Lake. You can see it on NY-NJ map 142 as a dotted line beginning just north of the lake. That will save you a 500' loss and regain of elevation.

10. There are various sites scattered about in the same vicinity.

11. The road walk will be about four miles, if you come out via the Elm Ridge Trail, with a climb of about 350' toward the end. You would follow Peck Road, go west on Big Hollow Road, south on Maple Crest Road, then east on Elmer Barnum Road to complete the loop.

Hope this helps. Happy hiking!