Finger Slide - Giant Mt.

[NoTrace]

Heading up the Finger Slide in the Western Cirque of Giant tomorrow (Sunday, August 13)... if anyone want to join me, best to call me at 518-664-2980. Will start out on the trail somewhere around 9 am.

Finger Slide is the long, narrow slide to the right of the Eagle, and the left of the Tulip.

If anyone has been up there and would like to give some advice, on route finding, I'm all ears!

[Mavs00]

Okay, okay.... no cross threading. There is a thread to address his thoughts about the 100, use it :D .

Hay, how bout a trip report, I've always heard great things about it. And no, I probably won't run right out and climb it. It'd make good reading.

[daxegraphix]

Wisht I had seen your post last week...
I've been up the Finger. Hope you had a good climb. I went up that one maybe a year or so ago. I never found the actual bottom of it. I went all the way up the chute and started up the Eagle before I realized my mistake.
I crossed over to the Finger through some bush.
Hope you found it OK.

[NoTrace]

Found it no problem, thanks to the info that "Joe H" posted here (something to the effect of look for the bottom near the last steep brook ascent to the Eagle Slide). If you have that info, it's pretty clear where it is - but what you have at the bottom is a pretty small gully that is overgrown and pretty well hidden. Climb up that gully for several minutes, and it'll open right up onto the slide. It was fun, grippy, and steep. And we left no trace.

Someone has cut (loppered and sawn) an illegal trail to the left of Roaring Brook, on the way up to the slide. Anyone else know anything about this?

[pete_hickey]

Wisht I had seen your post last week...
I've been up the Finger. Hope you had a good climb. I went up that one maybe a year or so ago. I never found the actual bottom of it. I went all the way up the chute and started up the Eagle before I realized my mistake.
I crossed over to the Finger through some bush.
Hope you found it OK.
Interesting, because the first time I did the Eagle, I started on the finger, but crossed over to the Eagle.

[Mavs00]

And we left no trace.

Someone has cut (loppered and sawn) an illegal trail to the left of Roaring Brook, on the way up to the slide. Anyone else know anything about this?

Good for you guys.

Trail slashing/cutting is really one of my pet peeves. I suspect though that it's probably not the hiking crowd in this case. I'm told that other elements of the extreme activity crowd are imfamous for the "cutting to slide" stuff. As hikers, we're probably guilty of following them and creation of more distinct herd paths, but the cutter themselves might not be us.

That's what I was told once about a few of the illeagal slide trails (Bennies Brook comes to mind).

Glad you had a good trip.

[NoTrace]

I reported the illegal trail cutting to DEC immediately. They were most interested. If anyone has any info on who the perps are, please let them know. You can send any info (or suspicions) to kalberga@gw.dec.state.ny.us

[pete_hickey]

Trail slashing/cutting is really one of my pet peeves.After seeing it done for 20 years, you start to become numb. "Here we go again." It does seem to be happening more frequently these days, though.

Usually, an illegal path cut to a slide is the work of skiers. The paths cut to summits are cut by hikers. There are exceptions (EG phelps)

[NoTrace]

This is a path that was almost certainly cut for the purpose of making the trip to the base of the Eagle Slide easier. My partner and I talked about this for some time as we followed the path, trying to determine whether it was for skiing or just easier access. Given the narrow width and tight turns and ups and downs, it is almost certainly not a ski trail. Someone just wanted to make it easier to get to the slide - the wilderness be damned.

[daxegraphix]

Part of the fun of slide climbing is getting to the base. That push to the final gully on Roaring Brook really isn't all that bad anyway. I don't know how or why somebody could or would do it.
I'd feel like a schmuck--much less having to look over your shoulder while you're cutting it. Speaking of DEC, while I was over on the North Fork of the Boquet the other day, I saw smoke through the trees and went towards it. Some family was camping right on the river. How can somebody get away with doing that? Later in the day I was going to make a small fire ring to cook up a couple of Johnsonville Brats and I just couldn't bring myself to do it. All the awareness-level raising is having some effect. I thought about what a mess the fire ring and the ashes and etc. would make and decided it wasn't neccessary. I cooked them over the flame of my stove. It was just like BBQ ing over the propane grill at home. Watch out for the grease dripping, though.
Poof.

[Affix Snow]

How much cutting was done?

Was it BIG trees or just clearing brush?

[Inge]

For the most part the cairns lead you to open woods away from the water. Small branches and less than 1 inch diameter growth has been trimmed where the path crosses a thicket. Actually I think that the area benefited from the reroute out of the stream bed. The route is pretty well designed except for the last 50yd returning to the drainage. The route takes one out of the stream where recent blowdown gets tedious. The jungle gym approach is still available for those that enjoy that - "something for everyone"! :D

[pete_hickey]

Interesting that there is very little reaction to this cutting compared to the couchie slashing. Follow this, and you will most likely see a very well defined path develop over the years. The combination of increasing popularity of slide climbing along with the cut path will increase its use.

"Hey, the Giant slides are now easier to get to. Lets do them."

[Inge]

I agree completely!

It reinforces my idea that the reason most folks on the forum care about Couchis is because they have been to Couchie and could make it there w/ their eyes closed, so they don't see any need to make the trail more obvious.

But the NEW route to a less visited venue is coooooool :cry: because it is beta for a destination on many of these same folks' wish lists.

I figure it that there are more people hiking as time goes on and that means more variety in the types of trips that they desire. The "wilderness" experience for everyone is different. Since I don't really consider the Adirondacks WILD, it is pretty much all the same to me. A trail is a trail whether it has big slashes or just trampled ground - it is a route that others have made easier to follow.

[Inge]

As a side note -
I would NEVER have posted that this path exists because it only causes more traffic. It appears to me that posting this kind of info just serves to promote the individual rather than the protection of the environment - a common trend around here (in my regretfully obnoxious :D observation). I discussed this reasoning w/ my hiking partner and he vehemently denied my accusations so I am just posing my thoughts to air them.

But in some cases, since the info is out there I don't hesitate to clarify inaccurate interpretations.

[Affix Snow]

Simply put.

If there is a secret area or "Stash" that you dont want people to go to, DONT TALK ABOUT IT let alone post it on the internet.

[Mavs00]

Interesting that there is very little reaction to this cutting compared to the couchie slashing.

Actually Pete, I'm not real pleased about it. I am tempted to post some really derogatory nasty comments, but I hesitate. As the one that posted the fist Couch thread on VFTT and ADKForum (followed up to death), there was some public "atta-boys" - and "way to go's", but don't be fooled there was a pretty good undercurrent of people that were displeased with my actions. Their was a fair bit of quiet barbs of cowboy Justice, Lynch mobism and self promoter. To be honest, if I posted my real thoughts on this topic, people would start (or continue.....) to think "what an a-hole" and stop listening.

For the record, I think it is incredible selfish for an individual (or group of individuals) to make the decision that the trail to the Finger Slide, Bennies Brook, Sewards (via Calkins) needs to be "easier" for the rest of us. Even if the trail or cutting is done in a particularly fine way. I think it's incredibly selfish for an individual (or group of individuals) to decide I need a better view on Redfield, Street, ST4, etc.........

It's one thing for an group with a collective interest (i.e. DEC, 46ers, ADK) to make that decision, but for one person to do it is flat wrong. What gives them the right. It changes the experience for all that follow, which is decidedly against every principal in Leave no trace.

btw, I do think Inge is right, the needlessness of the Couch incident was a big factor in the outrage, as well as an apparent "I have the right" attitude.

So yeah, I'm not happy when an illegal trail is cut, am I gonna scream every time it happens...... naaaaaaw. It's honestly not worth the aggravation. first and formeost, I'm just a hiker.

[lumberzac]

I think it has more to do with "enemy" having a face and name. I think if the suspect was known there would be a bigger reaction. I think if the suspect tried to defend their actions there would be an even bigger reaction.
I think Rik hit the nail on the head. It's far easier to show one's disgust when you have someone you can blame.

[Neil]

Interesting that there is very little reaction to this cutting compared to the couchie slashing.

That's a pretty astute observation. And I think there is lots of this type of thing all over the HPR. I've also seen it on the Kilburn slide and I also saw it, big time, half way between Elk Lake and Elk Pass on state land. The latter I referred to the DEC with pictures that linked the trail cutting directly to a well known Lodge and followed up with another email and a phone call but I don't think it went anywhere.

I know this for sure though: there will never be a herd path to the Emmons Slide.

[Dick]

I'm not sure if this is relevant to this discussion or not, but I have not seen much discussion about the Calkins Brook path to Donaldson, even back when it was created. It was illegally cut, though (I am told) done by someone who knew what they were doing as far as trailcutting was concerned.

Dick

[NoTrace]

As a side note -
I would NEVER have posted that this path exists because it only causes more traffic. It appears to me that posting this kind of info just serves to promote the individual rather than the protection of the environment - a common trend around here (in my regretfully obnoxious :D observation). I discussed this reasoning w/ my hiking partner and he vehemently denied my accusations so I am just posing my thoughts to air them.

But in some cases, since the info is out there I don't hesitate to clarify inaccurate interpretations.
Yeah, but it looks like you're enjoying the hell out of the fact that this illegal trail exists, Inge (see your earlier post), which is curious since you were bent out of shape for my mentioning it in this forum to begin with as "encouraging" further use. The SOLE reason I posted notice of it was NOT to encourage use of it but to encourage people with knowledge of the perpetrators to report them to DEC for prosecution. You can't have it both ways, Inge.

[Mavs00]

The SOLE reason I posted notice of it was NOT to encourage use of it but to encourage people with knowledge of the perpetrators to report them to DEC for prosecution.

I hope someone takes you up on it.

I don't know anything so it won't be me. Perhaps someone does know something and perhaps they'd be more comfortable doing it privately and without forum fanfare (I'd suggest that route ;) )

The procedure is:

Call 518-897-1200 --> Ask for the Rangers.......

You'll probably get the receptionist, Peggy. Tell her you want to report a vandalism incident in the Giant Mountain Wilderness. She will forward you to a ranger that works that area.

Then it will be up to THEM to go out and determine the legality issues, damage, Investigative process, ect... That's the way our system works.

[Affix Snow]

And if the Rangers cant do anything about it, call....

http://images-eu.amazon.com/images/P/B0006VZ5WG.03.LZZZZZZZ.jpg

[Mavs00]

Say, huhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh.......

I know you ain't making fun of me snow.

Don't make me go "howling mad" Murdock on your a$$ :whip: ;)

[Inge]

I don't see that anything more can be done to "catch" the folks that made this path since you reported it to Ranger Kris and he responded w/ something like - that sh*t happens and we are doing are best to prevent it. By that I mean that it is fine to report to the authorities (Ranger Kris), but I didn't think there was any benefit to reporting it online.

Since it has become public info, by your reporting it on this forum, I don't see anything wrong w/ giving more info out about the conditions of this path. It's not like it is a secret anymore and it's not like we can stick the branches back together .....


So I feel like I'm just being realistic about the whole thing.
PS When are we going back for the Diagonal or Bottle?! :D